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Apple still have their logo. If Apple exces go to the graphics storage cupboard and find the logo missing and unavailable for them to use, then it might well have been "stolen".


As my boss constantly likes to point out; the law on "theft" was long ago changed from "permanently deprived" to cover information loss.

(at least in the UK, I understand the same happened in the US)


I very much doubt it. The Supreme Court declared a while ago that copyright infringement is not theft.


Thanks, that's good info.

I'm surprised. When the issue of auto-theft came up (many years ago) the ruling was very different. Legally speaking if you took a car for a spin and dumped it (back with the owner, or whatever) this was technically not theft - as there was no intent to permanently deprive the owner of the car.

I'm pretty sure they ruled it was still considered theft - off the back of similar legislation changes in the UK.


It's worth pointing out (I can't edit my previous comment) I was just responding to the one issue, and the problem is more nuanced... for example:

- The law wasn't really reconsidered to deal with copyright infringement. It was changed to deal with situations where you broke into a computer and took copies of data (interesting to note that this was not actually a new issue at the time; if you broke into someone's office and took photos of data they couldn't charge you with theft - the reason it was changed this time I am not sure on, probably just the prevailing mood).

- Quite how much the extent of information loss on a public thing like an image (for which you have to undertake no infiltration or transformative process to recover) applies is largely untested, because this stuff is broadly dealt with under copyright infringement

- The extent to which money - both loss of, and the making of (by the infringer) - comes into it is undetermined.

- This is not a new change. It happened years ago (as in at least the 90's, perhaps before).

The real bottom line is that much of our laws are inadequate in dealing with the internet. :)

But; "theft" is no longer defined, in the UK at least, as the GP indicated.


But that is the point, Apple have not lost the information - they still have their icon and can keep using it. There's a distinction between that and someone breaking into Apple's computer system and erasing all of their other copies of the icon, which would be the closest analogy to classical theft in this case.


"classical theft"?

We always complain about the fact that laws don't keep up with the modern world. So why insist that the definition of theft stays in the dark ages? :)

The analogy you bring up is more akin to vandalism in my mind. Theft, in the modern sense, means taking something that isn't yours.

(I'm not necessarily agreeing with the theory that this is theft; just putting out a data point I happen to know of)


I appreciate the appeal to what feels like common sense, but right now more than ever, the distinction between "classical theft" and replicating a series of ones and zeroes is extremely important. A war of minds is going on, and the relegation of all things copyright into the category of "theft" attempts to subtly justify any reaction to copyright infringement by making it equivalent to deprivation of property.

This is a tough topic because the word steal does have a valid semantic meaning in this context, and anyone who argues with common use of language always comes off as pedantic ('what is an iTouch? It's an iPod Touch!!!'), but its important for those of us who understand how digital media works continue to continue emphasizing the real world differences between theft and copyright infringement.


It's not theft of the digital entity, it's theft of the time and effort that went into creating the digital entity. The relevant concept is Theft Of Services.


The relevant concept is Theft Of Services

Theft of services still implies the consumption of someone else's resources. By not paying for the service, the provider faces tangible losses (because the opportunity to service a paying customer is lost). In this particular case, Apple loses absolutely nothing. The designer is still wrong (and IMO, plagiarizing copyrighted design assets merits termination), but Apple's capacity to service their customers is not hindered by this.


You got a citation for that?


Well that would be my boss; an ex-copper who was part of the working group that contributed to the new laws.

I can dig up another one if you really want :)


I'd like that.




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